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Phid, I'm just lookng at the incident itself and not the motivation (whatever that may have been).What I meant by someone from Hezbollah doing it is, he can do the exact same thing (same method, number of those killed), but his motivation would, I thnk, be more political therefore defined more as terrorism I'm sort of thinking of a lone suicide bomber that drives his van into a school or something like. Same results, different reasons. But, yet, that would rightfully be called an act of terrorismThis shooting was a psycho incident more than anything. I'm not implying that he was a terrorist or that this was a terrrorist incident, I'm just raising the question, if done by someone else like Hezbollah, would it be defined as a terrorist act?Seems like it's a fine line between a criminal act and terrorism. It depends on who does it I guess.
If it was done by a terrorist group then yes it is terrorisim. This however was not, just some deranged person who finally lost it. In the end its all about motivation.
I saw a story linked from Drudge in which some bloggers have been pondering a terrorism link because of the killer's use of the term “Ismail Axe”:
As for the term's meaning, one popular theory spreading across the web comes from a story in the Koran, the holy book of Islam, about Ibrahim and his son, Ismail. This theory picked up speed because many bloggers wondered if the actions at Virginia Tech could be related to terrorism.]As for the term's meaning, one popular theory spreading across the web comes from a story in the Koran, the holy book of Islam, about Ibrahim and his son, Ismail. This theory picked up speed because many bloggers wondered if the actions at Virginia Tech could be related to terrorism.
http://www.theage.com.au/news/technology/ismail-ax-sparks-web-frenzy/2007/04/18/1176696889800.html?s_cid=rss_ageRight now I think it's too premature to conclude this. Besides, the story I cited also presents other plausible theories on the origin of the phrase. Right now nothing I've heard would lead me to connect the killings with Islamic terrorism.
... a socio-political statement of fear and intimidation. .... If there was some socio-political motivation ....
IMHO; if this is applies and you disagree or are the target it is terrorism. If on the other-hand you agree or are the perp then it is patriotism. Sad but true.The VT killings (without real political intent) are neither... they are the work of a whack-job intent on getting his 15 minutes of fame. The media has granted his wish; condolences to all the families of the victims and the family of Cho as well.Wally
Wally is right, phsyco. But every time something like this happens they will try and read terro into it. sadly I'm sure the media was glad it happened, they love the ratings, Cho made them alot of money.
I don't think I'd say that the media was glad he did it, but they certainly didn't help the world much by broadcasting the images all over like they did. What better way to give some kid out there the impression that the killer went down in style. Irresponsible, irresponsible.
... certainly didn't help the world much by broadcasting the images all over like they did. What better way to give some kid out there the impression that the killer went down in style. Irresponsible, irresponsible.
I'm a middle school social science teacher; another of the mandates we have is a program called "Too Good For Violence"... and a feature of it is to try to debunk the media (news and entertainment) driven misconception that we are a violent society. The point of the program is two fold, to make kids aware solving things by violence isn't the norm and to emphasize ways to solve problems without (or before) violence is the answer. It shouldn't be necessary but the circus surrounding VT (yes we need to know but not all that has been reported) demands that we reply, "THIS IS NOT NORMAL!"Sooo, along with content standarts, character building, drug and alcohol education, AIDS awareness, health food choices, and all the rest we need to tell kids it's not normal to kill everyone in sight if you get teased or feel like you're left out.My view from the classroom,Wally
Wally, I'm impressed – that's a really great idea, something which should probably be done at the high school and even college level as well. “Given this set of circumstances, what better ways could he have handled the situation of being picked upon?” Sounds like pretty basic stuff but evidently the basic lessons of living in a society where there is friction and people are mean to you does not get through to everyone. Granted, it sounded like this particular kid had some mental problems, but I would be that even someone like him could have benefited from being exposed to alternative methods of responding to adversity. I think at a time like this - right after a major incident - it's the best time for such as "teaching moment" so as to ward off similar acts in the future. One thing for sure is that there are plenty of kids out there getting bullied around and picked upon and probably having similar experiences to what the killer was going through before his rampage.
... really great idea, something which should probably be done at the high school and even college level as well. "Given this set of circumstances, what better ways could he have handled the situation of being picked upon?" Sounds like pretty basic stuff but evidently the basic lessons of living in a society where there is friction and people are mean to you does not get through to everyone. Granted, it sounded like this particular kid had some mental problems, but I would be that even someone like him could have benefited from being exposed to alternative methods of responding to adversity.
While I am in agreement, mostly, my concern is this should have (and used to be) gotten accomplished in the home. The schools have sooo many mandates that we aren't able to focus enough to be really effective. Society needs to realize the schools can't do it all.
I think at a time like this - right after a major incident - it's the best time for such as "teaching moment"....
Yes and I'm one who uses them; standards and NCLB don't make citizens out of our kids... teachers that make them think about their place and role in the scheme of things do. I'd rather make a good citizen than raise the test scores. [much to the dismay of some of the higher-ups in my dsitrict]Sorry to rant,Wally
The other problem is, is that expecting the schools to do this is crazy. They have already tied the hands of the schools to the point where they cant do much of anything when it comes to children and yet they are expecting them to take over as parents even so.
Could this be considered related to “terrorism”?Police raids in Britain, Europe over animal rights extremismSaw a link to it on Drudge. I think it would fit in with the concept. Unfortunately we don't seem to take it very seriously.
The question of whether a form of eco-terrorism can properly be considered “terrorism” under law by a judge in the near future. Arsonists, yes. But are they terrorists? I think that this issue is therefore timely and we'll get a new perspective on it in the near future.
to research facilities, a ski resort and other businesses
I don't think that should be considered terrorism.but this
toppling of a high-tension power line
is questionable. Was this just a power line to Vail Ski Resort (grrr :x) or another business? Or was this a main power line for a population of people?I think an act would be defined as terrorism if they vandalized power plants or other utilities.
I don't think that should be considered terrorism.but thisis questionable. Was this just a power line to Vail Ski Resort (grrr :x) or another business? Or was this a main power line for a population of people?I think an act would be defined as terrorism if they vandalized power plants or other utilities.
But Ski, didn't you read the following:
Prosecutors want Judge Ann Aiken to declare the group terrorists ? something defense attorneys argue has never happened in 1,200 arsons nationwide claimed by Earth Liberation Front and Animal Liberation Front.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070515/ap_on_re_us/arson_pleas_5;_ylt=Agwm2oZ6i30Xqc1S7xatPvgE1vAIIf you were to take away the particular ideological motives for a second and just look at the facts, you'd have a covert group of individuals which discretely acts within an organized structure attempting to intimidate and/or inflict heavy financial losses on non-combatant citizens through illegal means for distinctively ideological ends. I think the "1200 arsons" part from above is significant of itself.
