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A person at an economic think tank in Britain thinks that there's something to be said about the medieval way of handling work and debt. Here's part of the claim:
A small farmer in the 1100s would be able to make enough money to live off while taking up to 170 days off a year, but since then work has gradually become more dominant in our lives, he said.He estimated that a similar person in 1495 would need to work for 15 weeks of the year to earn a sufficient amount to live, while in 1564 the figure was 40 weeks and today most British households need two people on full-time incomes to maintain a home and family.
I'm thinking there's got to be something/many things missing from this consideration. What is the percentage of one's income that goes toward the government in the Middle Ages compared to today? What was the expected standard of living? What happened to people who could not work in the Middle Ages? How long did they live?Seems to me that there are just too many differences between medieval and modern life to make constructive comparisons. What was a viable option at one point in history is not a viable option now.
I think there is something to it. Think about this; prior to about 1975 or so it was possible for the average american family to get by on one income and actually do fairly well. Why is that not so now? Have things really changed so much in 30 years that one income is simply not sufficient, and if so what are these things?My mother never worked when I was growing up and I think my family did pretty well. BTW, I have 3 brothers and we all went to parochial and not public schools and my parents owned our home. My dad retired from the Military in 1980 and then worked at a graphics company processing large prints because that is the kind of stuff he did in the Air Force. He also got laid off in 1983 and did not find another job until 1986 when he got picked up by the Post Office with Veterans preference. We also ran the family farm.
Fiat currencies mean inflation and inflation means working more and more hours to make the same amount of “money” to cover expenses. The invention of “credit” allowed for people to buy goods that formerly were out of reach, which increased demand, which drove up prices, which in turn raised debt burdens eventually creating a debtor slave class. 🙂
I get the fiat currency piece, in fact I would love to see a return to the gold standard, but I would argue that the rising cycle of debt has more to do with it than anything else. That and consumerism or good old keeping up with the Jones's, which feeds people getting deeper into debt. Everybody seems to HAVE to have the latest gadgets and toys nowadays. I am amazed at the number of people I know that have thousands of dollars worth of possessions but not a dime in savings. The best piece of advice I ever got from my father was to save 20% of my income. Thanks to that advice I will be able to get by without a job or even my retirement check after I retire and still be able to live comfortably. That financial cushion is one reason I feel secure enough to try starting my own business when I get out of the army.Speaking of currency, despite American economic weakness, I am staying out of the Euro for now or at least not moving any more cash from the states. Personally, I see the Euro dissolving in favor of a return to national currencies within 2-3 years if not sooner. Not sure how that will impact my German bank accounts but if the conversion to the Euro is any guide, it will not be pretty.
Speaking of currency, despite American economic weakness, I am staying out of the Euro for now or at least not moving any more cash from the states. Personally, I see the Euro dissolving in favor of a return to national currencies within 2-3 years if not sooner. Not sure how that will impact my German bank accounts but if the conversion to the Euro is any guide, it will not be pretty.
That's a very bold prediction. It will be interesting to see if it holds true.
Check about your Tax Freedom DayEach year, the Tax Foundation publishes a report, in which they have calculated the date on which the average US taxpayer has worked long enough, to earn enough money, to pay all of his taxes for that year. For obvious reasons, the Tax Foundation refers to this date as Tax Freedom Day.http://actionamerica.org/taxecon/taxfrdmclk.shtml http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_Freedom_Day#Tax_Freedom_Day_around_the_world Then let's compare with the Middle Ages
Speaking of currency, despite American economic weakness, I am staying out of the Euro for now or at least not moving any more cash from the states. Personally, I see the Euro dissolving in favor of a return to national currencies within 2-3 years if not sooner. Not sure how that will impact my German bank accounts but if the conversion to the Euro is any guide, it will not be pretty.
That's a very bold prediction. It will be interesting to see if it holds true.
I don't think ? will dissolve back to national currencies; the ? current problems are due to pure speculation
The current ? problems are due to blatant cheating by the Greeks and debt to GDP violations by the rest of the Eurozone countries in an effort to sustain the social welfare systems. The biggest problem with the Euro is the lack of a central bank with any monetary authority. I fully expect Greece to default on their debt anyway and for Ireland and Spain to follow and perhaps Italy and Portugal.
I think there is something to it. Think about this; prior to about 1975 or so it was possible for the average american family to get by on one income and actually do fairly well. Why is that not so now? Have things really changed so much in 30 years that one income is simply not sufficient, and if so what are these things?My mother never worked when I was growing up and I think my family did pretty well. BTW, I have 3 brothers and we all went to parochial and not public schools and my parents owned our home. My dad retired from the Military in 1980 and then worked at a graphics company processing large prints because that is the kind of stuff he did in the Air Force. He also got laid off in 1983 and did not find another job until 1986 when he got picked up by the Post Office with Veterans preference. We also ran the family farm.
I have heard that the level of taxation in the U.S. (and probably Europe as well) has made it so that a family which could have survived on a single income 80 years ago or so would need two incomes to survive. One would expect that because the government is gaining more taxation income there would be an increase in the quality of life. I suppose that is true in some regards compared to years ago, but it's a debatable subject.
Fiat currencies mean inflation and inflation means working more and more hours to make the same amount of "money" to cover expenses. The invention of "credit" allowed for people to buy goods that formerly were out of reach, which increased demand, which drove up prices, which in turn raised debt burdens eventually creating a debtor slave class. 🙂
That's an interesting thesis, but it may suggest an offsetting increase in efficiency or opportunity associated with the ability of the "lower" class to make purchases. In the Middle Ages, if a farmer needed a horse to pull a wagon, he would have to do without for lack of credit. So while this inability would mean he was not part of a "debtor slave class", he would still have been part of an "economic slave class" (if you will) because he wouldn't have been able to produce as many bushels because of the lack of a horse.So while debt has its pitfalls, it also has its advantages. Just like everything in a free market economy. 🙂
The current ? problems are due to blatant cheating by the Greeks and debt to GDP violations by the rest of the Eurozone countries in an effort to sustain the social welfare systems. The biggest problem with the Euro is the lack of a central bank with any monetary authority. I fully expect Greece to default on their debt anyway and for Ireland and Spain to follow and perhaps Italy and Portugal.
The European Central Bank (ECB) is the institution of the European Union (EU) tasked with administrating the monetary policy of the 16 EU member states taking part in the Eurozone. It is thus one of the world's most important central banks. The bank was established by the Treaty of Amsterdam in 1998, and is headquartered in Frankfurt, Germany.http://www.ecb.int/home/html/index.en.html
Aeth, How much real power does the ECB have? It cannnot effectively control monetary policy because that is in the hands of the individual eurozone countries. The root of the problem is spelled out on its own web page, Monetary policy instruments. It is the decentralized nature of the execution of monetary policy that hamstrings the ECB's responses in a crisis and leads to hat happened with Greece where the markets were essentially left wondering for over a month while the collective heads of the Eurozone governments decided what to do. That delay probably made the pain worse than it needed to be.Personally, I am staying out of the Euro as much as possible right now and have started divesting myself of Euro assets in favor of gold, to be honest, I am doing the same thing with Dollars too. I worry about excessive debt on both sides of the ocean. It seems to me that governments are now doing the same thing homeowners were doing in the states that started this whole mess. The critical difference is there is nobody to bail governments out when they ultimately fail or default. You cannot borrow your way out of a debt crisis, that just compounds the problem.
Terry Jones did a TV series called medieval lives and in one episode 'The Peasant' he mentions something along the lines of many peasants in those days living relatively good if not better than many of us today.
The key word there is relatively. I personally think comparisons between medieval peasants and today's working class is comparing apples and oranges. There is literally no comparison. The average poor person in western countries today lives better than royalty did in the middle ages except possibly for travel. There is no doubt that they live longer and healthier lives with food, entertainment, and clothing choices that even royalty did not have.
