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March 14, 2010 at 9:28 pm #2019PhidippidesKeymaster
Are there any non-Biblical references to Joseph (the youngest of twelve brothers) within the Pharaoh's administration in Egypt when the famine struck?
March 18, 2010 at 3:37 pm #19548PhidippidesKeymasterReally? Does no one (read: Donnie) not know this? I was reading or heard the account of Joseph confronting his brothers in Egypt after the famine – those who come to him after famine devastates the land. The thought crossed my mind that Joseph's position within the pharaoh's administration was quite high and that there may be textual evidence that corroborates the Biblical account. I realize that Egyptian record keeping might not have been on par with that of some other ancient civilizations, but I continue to wonder if there were are such extant sources.
March 18, 2010 at 8:25 pm #19549DonaldBakerParticipantReally? Does no one (read: Donnie) not know this? I was reading or heard the account of Joseph confronting his brothers in Egypt after the famine - those who come to him after famine devastates the land. The thought crossed my mind that Joseph's position within the pharaoh's administration was quite high and that there may be textual evidence that corroborates the Biblical account. I realize that Egyptian record keeping might not have been on par with that of some other ancient civilizations, but I continue to wonder if there were are such extant sources.
I believe there was a non-Biblical source that mentions Joseph (it might have been Egyptian records or something). The reason I haven't answered yes, is because I have to go and track down that source I read. This isn't something I would track down on the internet per se because I don't trust many sites on information like this because it is a hot button topic used to debunk the Biblical account of the Jews as slaves in Egypt (a point that actually is debated).
March 19, 2010 at 6:21 am #19550PhidippidesKeymasterThat's interesting – I didn't realize it was a point of tension.
March 27, 2010 at 9:18 pm #19551DonaldBakerParticipantI'm still working on this. Joseph allegedly rose to power during the Hyksos period (that is if he existed at all) which is the point of contention. I am looking for a scholarly article dealing with this such as this one: http://www.jstor.org/pss/3140543I no longer have access to JSTOR so I can't read the whole article, but I think I know someone who can. If that person has the time, please download it and email me a copy. (Note: I did not just say what you think I did JSTOR cops). 🙂
March 27, 2010 at 9:28 pm #19552PhidippidesKeymasterI no longer have access to JSTOR so I can't read the whole article, but I think I know someone who can. If that person has the time, please download it and email me a copy. (Note: I did not just say what you think I did JSTOR cops). 🙂
I was going to say - that's a no-no for JSTOR, and the cops WILL find you, and they WILL beat you and...Oh well you can save yourself the trouble anyway and read it directly through Google Books which has the complete article that you can download for free, or read online:http://books.google.com/books?id=lJoNAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA347&dq=The+Hyksos+in+Egypt&hl=en&ei=rXiuS8DhOoviNaLl1JkF&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CEYQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=The%20Hyksos%20in%20Egypt&f=false
March 27, 2010 at 11:05 pm #19553DonaldBakerParticipantI no longer have access to JSTOR so I can't read the whole article, but I think I know someone who can. If that person has the time, please download it and email me a copy. (Note: I did not just say what you think I did JSTOR cops). 🙂
I was going to say - that's a no-no for JSTOR, and the cops WILL find you, and they WILL beat you and...Oh well you can save yourself the trouble anyway and read it directly through Google Books which has the complete article that you can download for free, or read online:http://books.google.com/books?id=lJoNAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA347&dq=The+Hyksos+in+Egypt&hl=en&ei=rXiuS8DhOoviNaLl1JkF&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CEYQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=The%20Hyksos%20in%20Egypt&f=false
If I was JSTOR, I would be more than a little upset with Google. Thanks for the link, I downloaded the entire journal.
March 28, 2010 at 2:52 am #19554PhidippidesKeymasterIf it was published before 1922, like that journal article was, it's normally in the public domain – and a good chance that Google has scanned it in. I've been finding some primary sources that date back to the 19th century or so as I am working on my Masters thesis…Google is a real gem in that regard.
March 28, 2010 at 4:17 pm #19555DonaldBakerParticipantIf it was published before 1922, like that journal article was, it's normally in the public domain - and a good chance that Google has scanned it in. I've been finding some primary sources that date back to the 19th century or so as I am working on my Masters thesis...Google is a real gem in that regard.
I read their policy of respecting copyrights so I guess this isn't a big deal. So really JSTOR should do the same thing for stuff that old instead of charging $14.00 to purchase something in the public domain anyway. Bad JSTOR, bad....LOL
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